Craps - General Questions
Ray from Plainfield, USA
Show me a player making opposite, or near opposite, bets and I'll show you a player up to something. He is probably trying to take advantage of a promotion or comps. If I ran a casino, I would give credit only for money being risked. One could argue he is risking $10, because a 12 will cause the pass to win and the don't pass to push. However, that will happen 1 in 36 pass line bets only. If I ran a casino, I would give him an average bet of $0.
No, you were paid correctly. The 11 does pay 15:1 on the $5 of your bet. However you lost the other $15 on the 2, 3, and 12. So $75-$15=$60. Instead of taking the $15 from your bet, they take it from the winnings.
Dave from Roanoke, Virginia
Thanks for the compliment. The Spanish 21 rules are the same across Atlantic City. I only know of two that have the game, the Tropicana and the Claridge, but there could be others by now. If I'm not mistaken, the best craps game is at the Sands, which offers 5X odds. When I say to take the maximum odds I mean bet the maximum allowed on the odds. For example, $50 after a $10 line bet. Keep in mind that you won't win more money by taking the odds, you just get to bet more without losing more in the long run.
Mary from Rising Sun, USA
I don't know the hold for any game. For the benefit of other readers, the hold percentage is the ratio of casino profit to chips purchased at the table. Since the same chips will circulate back and forth between the players and dealer for an unknown period of time, the mathematician has no way of calculating the hold or hold percentage.
Tim from San Antonio, Texas
I asked my friend Larry Drummond, a craps dealer and former webmaster of Next Shooter for help on this question. Larry can be a bit abrasive but is a good source of hard to find information on craps. Here is what he said, "Comps for craps vary from Casino to Casino and from Boxman to Boxman. A player should get to know the Boxman. The Boxman sets the players average bet and tracks the TIME that a player is at the table. It is easier for the Boxman to track action for COMPS. if the player is consistent in their wagering pattern. Now, I ask you ... if a player goes $52 or $54 across after a Point is established with a $5 flat bet on the Pass Line. Is that a $57 or $59 average? ... Or a $5 average with a whole bunch of other INDIVIDUAL bets? The answer is... IT DEPENDS ON HOW WELL YOU KNOW THE BOXMAN and HOW MANY TIMES TO YOU ATTEND THIS PARTICULAR CASINO."
Larry added in another e-mail the following, "In addition to the information I already sent to you ... ODDS on Pass Line and Come bets are often NOT included in the AVERAGE for comps. Same with LAYING ODDS on the Don’t Side... as in the long run this should be a WASH. But ... If a smart boxman wants someone who is spending big bucks on ANY 7, the worst bet on the table... he would probably average the ODDS and the LAYS to keep the sucker coming back to the casino ... you can re-word this to make it a little more palatable for your site ... In addition ... A good boxman will COMP to the MAX if he sees that the PLAYER is "betting for the boys."
Brian E. from Raleigh, USA
I wasn’t planning on it. There are so many betting patterns in craps that one analysis would only fit a small percentage of craps players.
Thank you for the kind words. I still say that the house edge is not dependent on the number of come bets you make. Yes, it is depressing to establish one come point after another and then lose everything on a seven. However there are other times when the shooter takes ages before rolling a seven and you win lots of come bets along the way.
In California dice alone can not be used to determine the outcome of a game. To get around this law many casinos use a hybrid of cards and dice, or cards only. My crap section now addresses some of the ways this is done.
The following tables show the number of hands/tosses per hour in blackjack, craps, and roulette. The source of the tables is Casino Operations Management by Jim Kilby.
Hands per Hour in Blackjack
|Players||Hands per hour|
Rolls per Hour in Craps
|Players||Rolls per hour|
In craps 29.6% of total rolls are come out rolls, on average.
Spins per Hour in Roulette
|Players||Spins per hour|
Chris K from Los Angeles
You could do a tournament. Every player will buy in for the same amount of non-cashable chips. Establish somebody to be the banker, paying off bets as in normal craps. Whoever has the most chips after some benchmark, for example x 7-outs, wins the pool. Since you will have an even chance with everybody else, I think it would be okay to ask for tips for the use of your house.
Dennis from Henderson, NV
Two suppliers of gaming tables I am aware of are TCS John Huxley and Midwest Game Supply. They probably do sell to the public. The price of a craps table at Midwest Game Supply is $3,950. If a used one will suffice, the Gambler's General Store sells used tables.
According to the the Bone Man at NextShooter.com, here is where and when you can find the tubs:
One Tub at Wild, Wild West (probably open only evenings, weekdays, and on weekends).
One Tub at Ellis Island (probably open only evenings, weekdays, and on weekends).
One Tub at Circus Circus in West Casino section, hardly ever open unless on busy holiday.
2010 update: I hear the Ellis Island replaced the tub with a full craps table.
Eddie from Seattle
The expected number of total rolls is 1671/196 = 8.5255. Interestingly, the expected number of rolls for a point is exactly 6. That leaves 2.5255 come out rolls. So the percentage of come out rolls is 2.5255/8.5255 = 29.6%.
The answer is 50/50. This will be true for any number of dice rolled, not just two.
A bit off-topic, but I've always thought an odd/even set of bets would be a good way to replace the dreaded big 6/8 bets in craps. To give the house an advantage, here are my proposed pay tables and analysis.
|3 or 11||1.5||4||0.111111||0.166667|
|5 or 9||1||8||0.222222||0.222222|
|2 or 12||3||2||0.055556||0.166667|
|4 or 10||1||6||0.166667||0.166667|
|6 or 8||0.5||10||0.277778||0.138889|
Please note that I claim all rights with this publication.
This question is raised and discussed in my forum at Wizard of Vegas.
What is the etiquette of tipping the shooter in craps?
There is absolutely no expectation of tipping the shooter ever! I would go as far as to ask you not to, lest it become a "thing," and leeches start hanging around the table, only betting on their turn, and shaking other players down for tips. This whole culture of tipping in casinos is getting completely out of hand.
This question is raised and discussed in my forum at Wizard of Vegas.
Assume I'm playing craps at a table with 100x odds. I'm debating whether to make a place bet on the 6 or 8 or a put bet. How much odds would I have to put on a put bet to have a better value than the place bet.
Larry from Las Vegas
Good question. The house edge on a place bet on the 6 or 8 is 1.52%. At 5x odds, the overall house edge is exactly the same on a put bet on the 6 or 8 at 1.52%. At 6x odds, it drops to 1.30%. So, it takes 6x odds to become a better value.
The Iron Cross is a way of betting the field and place bets to win on any roll of the dice except a 7. The field already covers the 2, 3, 4, 9, 10, 11, and 12. The player will add to that place bets on the 5, 6, and 8 to cover the rest of the numbers, besides 7. The following table shows what the math looks like with a $5 field bet, $5 place bet on the 5, and $6 place bets on the 6 and 8.
The lower right cell of the table shows an expected loss of $0.25. The total amount bet is $22. This makes the overall house edge $0.25/$22 = 1/88 = 1.14%.
At this point you may be wondering how this house edge can be lower than the house edge of each individual bet. The answer is because the house edge of 1.52% placing the 6 and 8 and 4.00% placing the 5 is based on per bet resolved. If define the house edge on place bets on a per roll basis, then the house edge placing the 6 or 8 is 0.46% and on the 5 is 1.11%.
We can get at the 1.14% house edge by taking a weighted average of all bets made, as follows:
($5*2.78% + $5*1.11% + $12*0.46%)/22 = $0.25/$22 = 1.14%.
Be wary of casinos that pay only 2 to 1 for 12 on the field bet. Insist on getting the full 3 to 1. The short pay doubles the house edge on that bet from 2.78% to 5.56%.As to my opinion, compared to most games, 1.14% is a pretty good bet. However, you could do much better in craps. For example, with 3-4-5x odds, making the pass and come bets, with full odds, you can get the house edge down to 0.37%. Doing the opposite, betting the don't pass and don't come, plus laying full odds, results in a house edge of 0.27%.
The standard deviation, relative to the pass bet, with full 3-4-5x odds is 4.915632.
The standard deviation, relative to the don't pass bet, laying full 3-4-5x odds is 4.912807.